Logic Pro 8 Mixing Questions

[miguelmarques]

Hello there!

I'm a long time Digital Performer user and i'm making the switch to Logic. I've got some questions about working in Logic, and I couldn't find the ansewrs in the manual so i'm going to try here!

1. I've learn how to create, edit and delete fades on a track using the crossfade tool. But, imagine I have 8 drums tracks and i would like to the same fade on all of them on one time! How can I do it?

2. Signal Flow question. I've already understand that the Master fader logic has isn't really a master fader. I've also understand buses, aux, outputs, etc. Imagine i have 10 tracks peaking at -3 dB going to Output 1-2. None of them is clipping but the 10 of them are. If i lower the output 1-2 i'm lowering a sinal that already has distorced. You can see in the insert by opening a metering plug-in that it's still distorcing. I can always lower the 10 tracks individually to avoid distortion but isn't there a way to control the signal flow going to Output 1-2?

That's it for now. Thank you all!

[Maurits]

Originally Posted by miguelmarques

Hello there!

2. Signal Flow question. I've already understand that the Master fader logic has isn't really a master fader. I've also understand buses, aux, outputs, etc. Imagine i have 10 tracks peaking at -3 dB going to Output 1-2. None of them is clipping but the 10 of them are. If i lower the output 1-2 i'm lowering a sinal that already has distorced.

Just for a laugh, try this: Put a gainer on all of your tracks, set them to some rediculously high gain, and lower the output fader (or even the master fader) until the level gets below 0dB again (maybe you need to use a gainer there as well and turn it way down). Do you hear distortion? No! That's the beauty of 'floating point mixing'. Inside the digital domain of the mixer, the headroom is infinite (of course there is limited definition but you will never exceed this as long as the final signal fits inside the 24 bits of the end result). The only thing you need to worry about is external analog plugins you might have in your channels (using the I/O plugin) and those plugins that have a response that depends on the signal level (most simulations of analog stuff).

With external equipment, you obviously want a signal below 0dB going there and coming back. With the non-linear plugins, it doesn't matter that much if the signal is slightly above 0dB.

So, in your situation, just turn down the fader of the output, or create some channel groups and turn them down a bit, and don't worry about the signal between the channels and the group fader. It is however good common practise to keep everything below 0dB, but that's because it helps you stay in control over the mix. You don't need to worry about distortions being caused by this.

Maurits.

[miguelmarques]

Originally Posted by Maurits

Just for a laugh, try this: Put a gainer on all of your tracks, set them to some rediculously high gain, and lower the output fader (or even the master fader) until the level gets below 0dB again (maybe you need to use a gainer there as well and turn it way down). Do you hear distortion? No! That's the beauty of 'floating point mixing'. Inside the digital domain of the mixer, the headroom is infinite (of course there is limited definition but you will never exceed this as long as the final signal fits inside the 24 bits of the end result). The only thing you need to worry about is external analog plugins you might have in your channels (using the I/O plugin) and those plugins that have a response that depends on the signal level (most simulations of analog stuff).

With external equipment, you obviously want a signal below 0dB going there and coming back. With the non-linear plugins, it doesn't matter that much if the signal is slightly above 0dB.

So, in your situation, just turn down the fader of the output, or create some channel groups and turn them down a bit, and don't worry about the signal between the channels and the group fader. It is however good common practise to keep everything below 0dB, but that's because it helps you stay in control over the mix. You don't need to worry about distortions being caused by this.

Maurits.

Yes, i've already noticed this!

The thing is i'm really keen on my signal flow and gain structure. And I really like to control what i'm sending to each plug-in for example.

I guess the solution is just to lower the individual track levels.

[leytonnz]

for the fades, just select all the regions and type the fade number into the numerical box corresponding to the length of the fade you want between 0-99999.

for changing multiple regions that have different fade times, select all the regions and you will see a "*" in the numeral value field hold down the option key and type the new value and all the regions will have that new value now.

for the drum scenario you describe though i would probably set up a group, or a drum mix bus, and use automation

FTR i know that floating point stuff but i keep my output at 0 and adjust the individual track levels ( this is just an old skool throwback to my old habits.. im happy with the results) :-) ... my autoload has all the individual tracks set at -8 db just so i get some "headroom" to start with.

L

[miguelmarques]

Originally Posted by leytonnz

for the fades, just select all the regions and type the fade number into the numerical box corresponding to the length of the fade you want between 0-99999.

for changing multiple regions that have different fade times, select all the regions and you will see a "*" in the numeral value field hold down the option key and type the new value and all the regions will have that new value now.

for the drum scenario you describe though i would probably set up a group, or a drum mix bus, and use automation

FTR i know that floating point stuff but i keep my output at 0 and adjust the individual track levels ( this is just an old skool throwback to my old habits.. im happy with the results) :-) ... my autoload has all the individual tracks set at -8 db just so i get some "headroom" to start with.

L

Sorry! I don't understand what you've told on this post..

[zerobeat]

Originally Posted by miguelmarques

1. I've learn how to create, edit and delete fades on a track using the crossfade tool. But, imagine I have 8 drums tracks and i would like to the same fade on all of them on one time! How can I do it?

At the right side of the Arrange is where you'll find the "Inspector" column (it's possibly to hide this, so if it is then find the "show inspector" command). At the top of the Inspector is the Region Parameters Box. When you select an Audio region, you'll see Fade parameters in there. Here you can numerically enter in fades. So if you select multiple regions, you can numerically enter in fade values for all selected regions.

Unfortunately, fades aren't available on Apple Loops and audio regions that have "Follow Tempo" enabled.

Originally Posted by miguelmarques

2. Signal Flow question. I've already understand that the Master fader logic has isn't really a master fader. I've also understand buses, aux, outputs, etc. Imagine i have 10 tracks peaking at -3 dB going to Output 1-2. None of them is clipping but the 10 of them are. If i lower the output 1-2 i'm lowering a sinal that already has distorced. You can see in the insert by opening a metering plug-in that it's still distorcing. I can always lower the 10 tracks individually to avoid distortion but isn't there a way to control the signal flow going to Output 1-2?:

The 32bit float nature of the audio engine means that it's quite possible to have apparent signal levels that LOOK distorted (red is flashing), but that aren't actually SONICALLY distorted.

The corollary to this is that with such a massive signal/noise ratio, there's no reason to practice a kind of gain staging where everything is at or near "the red". I start out all my mixes with the track faders down low (say, -10dB) and turn up the volume to the speakers. That way I get tons of headroom.

I generally get a better sound when nothing is particularly hot inside the mix. What happens is that because most people tend to favour louder sounds ("ooh, that sound great... turn it up louder"), they don't realize that the exact same excitement could have been achieved by turning up the volume to the speakers and therefore not sacrificing the sound quality of the mix itself. That tiny bit of extra noise is not only no big deal, but can actually pad out the mix in a pleasurable way.

[Eli]

Originally Posted by zerobeat

At the right side of the Arrange is where you'll find the "Inspector" column .

It's actually on the _other_ right side. The one commonly referred to as the left

I'm sure we all know what you meant; but just in case the original poster wasn't sure.....

[miguelmarques]

Thank you very much!

[zerobeat]

Originally Posted by zerobeat

At the right side of the Arrange is where you'll find the "Inspector" column .

Originally Posted by Eli

It's actually on the _other_ right side. The one commonly referred to as the left
I'm sure we all know what you meant; but just in case the original poster wasn't sure.....

D'oh! Er, I actually meant the "correct" side when I said "right" side. Yeah, that's the ticket. No, that's not it. What I meant to say is that I knew that Miguel used his computer whilst hanging upside down and that his right was our left.

[miguelmarques]

Originally Posted by zerobeat

D'oh! Er, I actually meant the "correct" side when I said "right" side. Yeah, that's the ticket. No, that's not it. What I meant to say is that I knew that Miguel used his computer whilst hanging upside down and that his right was our left.