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Arrangement markers

Discussion in 'Logic Pro X' started by michaelo, Jul 24, 2013.

  1. michaelo

    michaelo LUG Emeritus

    While I think Logic X is pretty darn good so far from my couple of days working with it (flex pitch is outstanding and also track stacks) I have to say I am less than impressed with the arrangement markers. This is the worst implementation of a great idea i have ever seen in Logic.
    They may work for really simple songs but for complex long songs with many overlapping ideas and parts it doesn't work IMO. They just turn your song into garbage and you are left trying to make sense of what just happened when you move one of them. Also you cannot delete them. They are really quite dangerous if you have one highlighted and hit delete is removes everything under it. Perhaps you can only use them if you begin an arrangement with them. Bizarre really.
  3. forgetr

    forgetr Member

    I like that they're there, but I agree that not being able to delete them without deleting the regions below the marker is "dangerous." Now that I mess around with it more, I do see how it's really a half-baked feature. Hopefully they get the kinks ironed out in a point release. Otherwise, this feature is useless if you have regions that overlap the marker borders.
  4. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    Cubase has had an elegant and very flexible Arranger tracks for years now.

    What's present in Lx is a good start.
  5. Orren Merton

    Orren Merton Logic Samurai / Administrator Staff Member

    My personal favorite was always Opcode's Vision/Studio Vision. It took the opposite tack: rather than moving around regions as you moved around Arrangement Markers, it had a playback queue, and you set up what to play in what order. That way, it was only the song position line that was moving around, not the regions.

    I think Digital Performer tried to do something similar with "chunks" but those are very inefficient, with gaps between chunks and all kinds of other issues.

    Anyway, I think the Arrangement Track is a welcome first step, but I'm with Michael, they need to improve it.

  6. Pete Thomas

    Pete Thomas Administrator Staff Member

    I thought that was the whole point, whatever you do to an arrangement marker apples to all the regions, so you would want the regions to delete if you delete an arrangement marker. I love them, and they work really well with Drummer.

    Plus, they don't replace normal markers, so if you don't like them, then just use the normal markers.
  7. Orren Merton

    Orren Merton Logic Samurai / Administrator Staff Member

    I agree with all that, but I believe that there needs to be a "clutch" where you can disengage it, so it's just another Global Marker, then delete it, without affecting the regions underneath. For example, what if you decide that rather than having "pre-chorus" and "chorus" markers, you just want to have one "chorus" arrangement marker? You can do this by changing marker lengths, but then you have an extraneous marker. At this point, I don't think there is any way to remove that extraneous marker from the Arrangement Track, no matter what you may try to do.

    So as I said, I think it's a very positive feature, but I'm looking forward to more being done with it.

  8. LSchefman

    LSchefman Senior member

    Actually, chunks is really all about additional sequences for cues, that can be moved efficiently to conform to picture edits for those of us who work with film and video. And it's a very efficient and sensible way to move to new cue points, etc.

    Because with chunks, tempos for various cues live in their own world. So moving a chunk to a new start point doesn't affect the tempo, and you don't have to redo all of that.

    For this reason, chunks is a much better solution to this particular problem (one I often face) than anything Logic has come up with to date.

    I still prefer Logic, but don't knock DP for that feature, it's pretty darn cool.
  9. Orren Merton

    Orren Merton Logic Samurai / Administrator Staff Member

    Shows you what I know. :) I had read that Chunks was supposed to be an arrangement track sort of thing, and didn't work quite right for it.

  10. Doug Zangar

    Doug Zangar Senior member

    DP's chunks is a nice feature. Logic's Arrangement Track is hopefully something to be expanded upon so it can then be called a nice feature.....
  11. EastWest Lurker

    EastWest Lurker Senior member

    I would characterize it as a nice feature that has the potential to be devloped into a great feature.

    But as someone who composes for picture, I would love to have DP's Chunks. Project Alternatives is a step in the right direction.
  12. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    The thing that would make Project Alternatives GREAT IMHO, would be if Logic didn't reload all its samples when switching between them. As it is now, it's not really significantly superior, other than for convenience, to the old Save As function. IMHO of course.

    Eli Krantzberg
    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  13. EastWest Lurker

    EastWest Lurker Senior member

    Exactly. But at least I can open a cue I will call M5 which was a variant with different tempi, number of measures etc. that I created from M2 without having to go to the Finder or Open Recent etc.

    Like I said, a step in the right direction.
  14. gdoubleyou

    gdoubleyou Senior member

    I did see that the arrangement track interacts with the Drummer instrument,
    Drummer will adjust for intro, verse, and chourus.

    No clue what happens when you rename, and add new arrangement regions.

  15. gdoubleyou

    gdoubleyou Senior member

    Studio Vision Pro!

    That reminds me, BOYCOTT Gibson!:mad:
  16. bayswater

    bayswater Senior member

    You might be remembering the DP Song window used as a sort of arranger where you drag in chunks and place them in lanes and in sequence.

    You can also set Chunks up in a sort of playlist, and this might be where you are recalling the gaps in playback.

    There's a lot of different things you can do with Chunks. Their main problem is that they're called chunks.

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