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Logic 9 Out-of-sync sample on Yamaha Piano Hall?

Discussion in 'Logic 9' started by kendradog, Sep 24, 2011.

  1. kendradog

    kendradog New Member

    I created a new empty project with one MIDI region set to Yamaha Piano Hall.

    I created two new notes, both at 1 1 1 1: D3 and F2.

    [​IMG]

    On piano roll playback, the F2 comes in just before the D3. I'd say, about 25 milliseconds too soon. The bounced AIFF is here: http://soundcloud.com/kendracute/output-1-2 .

    This appears to be another sampling bug in Yamaha Piano Hall (I posted about another sample bug in another thread).

    The chord sounds fine using "EXS Grand Piano" which is under the "Garage Band" instruments in the instrument selection menu, but that instrument has other problems.
     
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  3. Colin Shapiro

    Colin Shapiro Senior member

    I reproduced your example and it sounds fine here, at all velocities.

    Maybe your samples are corrupt?
    Open the EXS24 edit window, play the D3 and double-click the sample name in the list. It should open in the sample edit window. If you see a gap before the soundwave, that may be your problem.
     
  4. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    I recreated it here as well with the same channel strip setting and same notes and it worked fine. I agree that maybe some of your samples became corrupted. I don't know how that would happen, but it's easy enough to check if the start time is set incorrectly by examining the samples in the sample editor as Colin described.
     
  5. georgelegeriii

    georgelegeriii Senior member

    just to pipe in here: I will often move things to bar 2 due to the fact that Logic will sometimes not play audio back properly on Bar 1 beat 1 (the other thing is having reverbs clear the playback buffers as well).

    You issue might be that. I suggest moving things to bar 2 and see if it still happens.
     
  6. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    Good idea. I always start from bar 3 myself, and even have my smpte time set to have 01:00:00:00 correspond with bar 3. This leaves lots of time for a pickup if necessary, plus avoids starting at bar one.
     
  7. kendradog

    kendradog New Member

    Thank you all for your help and suggestions, it's appreciated. Hopefully this thread will be helpful to future users who run into this as well.

    The first-bar issue is useful to know, but in fact I had noticed the out-of-sync problem as part of a much longer piece. I just cut it down to get a simple example; the problem arises no matter which bar the notes arise.

    I did make a longer example that might be easier to hear than my short excerpt, and I also found some very strange things going on with the sample editor.

    The audio showing the long sample is here: http://soundcloud.com/kendracute/long-sync-problem .

    The screenshot showing the project from which this audio is taken is here:
    [​IMG] . Note that the D3-F2 chord is still out-of-sync in the bounced AIF file corresponding to this MIDI. Note that the velocities are 32. The problem does not arise with other velocities.

    I found several anomalies in the sample editor corresponding to the D3 sample for Yamaha Piano Hall. I am new to the sample editor so will describe my steps in some detail.

    I opened the EXS24 sample editor from the inspector, clicking "edit". I played the D3 and F2 notes in the piano bar, then clicked on the sample names. For each of the two notes, there were two samples with slightly different names.

    The waveform for D3 had two anomalies. First, in one of the two samples corresponding to D3, the waveform was silent for a while at the beginning of the sample. (Not sure what the time axis is).

    Second, for the D3 waveform, the text indicated the sample came from GarageBand, not from Logic!

    Here is the image of the sample editor that showed up when I clicked the D3 on the piano bar:

    [​IMG]

    Note that there are two samples selected, and that they are named something to do with D#3 instead of D3. Not sure why that would be.

    Anyway, here is the waveform for the first of the two samples corresponding to D3:

    [​IMG]

    Note that there is a delay in this waveform. This delay is obviously the cause of the out-of-sync sound. Note as well that the sample seems to come from GarageBand. How that could be, I do not know.

    Here for comparison is the waveform for the second of the two samples corresponding to D3:
    [​IMG]

    Note that this starts at the beginning, unlike the first of the two sample corresponding to D3, but that it also comes from GarageBand, not from Logic.

    Now, here is the edit window that appears when I click on the F2 note in the piano roll:

    [​IMG]

    This looks just like the D3 edit window, except that it is using F2 and not F#2 as with the case of D3.

    I did not upload the F2 window, but it looked OK to me, and the file name indicated the sample came from Logic not from Garageband like the D3 sample.

    I reinstalled Logic and the same problem recurred (I stupidly loaded a larger old project, which had saved audio files, after reinstalling though - could this older project have somehow corrupted the whole Logic sample set?)

    Could someone possibly check their sample for D3 in Yamaha Piano Hall at velocity of 32, and see if the name and waveform is the same as the one's I showed? (Assuming you are running Logic 9.1.5 (1700.9) (32-bit) .)
     
  8. kendradog

    kendradog New Member

    Please see my last post with screenshots. I appreciate your time again, but could you possibly just double-check the sample name and waveform for Yamaha Piano Hall on D3 at velocity of 32? As can be seen in the screenshots from my last post, I am getting odd results for that - even after reinstalling Logic!:brkwl::confused::mad:
     
  9. Colin Shapiro

    Colin Shapiro Senior member

    Okay, I just checked.
    The sample path here is identical to yours (ie Garageband folder).
    The sample is the same and the waveform is identical.

    I placed the F2 and D3 together (on bar 2 to avoid the problems mentioned above) and....I can hear the flam. (Must have somehow missed it before - maybe I didn't have velocity 32).

    I trimmed off the gap before the waveform and it sounds as it should. This was obviously just an overlooked bit of silence.

    Conclusion:
    1 - You are not going crazy. :)
    2 - Someone goofed in the editing room with this one.
     

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