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Logic X Recording in summing tracks - guitar multitrack patches

Discussion in 'Logic Pro X' started by mertas, Oct 1, 2016.

  1. mertas

    mertas New Member

    I created guitar sound patches. each has more tracks in one summing track.
    once I want to record guitar, I recall user patch, but got troubles like this:

    1. recording is not blue like audio, but also not green like midi
    2. due all the aux inside of summing track

    I created guitar patches. each has summing track and internal routing. I wanted to safe time to have sounds ready. but once I go recording I got more troubles:
    a, if I copy blue audio file to another guitar patch - no sound
    b, if I want to add same guitar patch using same input, than no recording possible anymore

    Is praxis rather to have DRY single channel guitar sounds and first in mixing proces start with routing to axes?
    could someone guide me, how to record 3 guitars from the same recording input without loosing signal for output and than use my patches and finalize mix?
    thanks


    screenshot: https://cloudup.com/iyuCVjjR4d1
    [​IMG]
     
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  3. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    Hello,

    I'm not sure I'm answering your question, but here goes...

    1st Attachment: Initial set up. This shows creating some audio tracks and aux channels.

    2nd Attachment: Creating Track Stack. All audio and aux channels are selected in the mixer. Selecting the indicated command from the mixer local Options menu will include the aux channels in the summing stack.

    3rd Attachment: Save as Patch. Save the summing stack as a user patch.

    4th Attachment: Patches. This shows adding another instance of the patch with all routings intact.

    Reproduce these simple step to see if they produce the results you want.

    Cheers
     

    Attached Files:

  4. mertas

    mertas New Member

    thanks, I know, how to create guitar patches. but question is usability of summing tracks.


    in Logic X I created guitar patches with complex sounds. Each has summing track, amp simulation, EQ and internal routing to subtracks via busses /reverb, delay/. I wanted to safe time to have sounds ready. Choosing complex patch is great, but seems to be useless in mixing afterwards.

    In case I want to do some changes with delay, reverb etc I have to flatten the summing track and completely remake routing and setting. so speed advantage from the beginning /using patch/ is gone, when it comes to mixing. do you agree?

    Is praxis rather to have as simple single track guitar sounds as possible and first in mixing proces start with routing to axes to avoid working with summing stacks?
     
  5. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    I don't understand why you have to flatten the stack to make changes to the delay or reverb.

    When the aux channels are included in the stack as shown above, then a new instance of the patch results in routing specific to the new summing stack. Changes to the delay in the yellow stack do not affect the settings in the green stack. Each inserted patch preserves the routing of your complex patch in the current project, and all new projects.

    You don't have to use summing stacks. Start with individual audio tracks and their aux channel effects if you like. But if you want to call up a complex setup in a new project, then saving the summing stack including the aux channels as a patch will quickly recreate this complex setup in the new project, or as a new instance within a given project, which my initial response demonstrated. It's possible I don't understand your question.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Oct 1, 2016
  6. mertas

    mertas New Member

    thanks for trying to help me. all you write is clear to me. but once you record with summing track - and you do not like some part of the sound - reverb, delay, whatever and can't make new recording (musicians are not available anymore). how will you proceed with recorded track?
     
  7. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    When setting up or loading a simple or complex patch, the guitar is monitored through the effects. The effects can be removed, or modified, after the recording. The recorded audio is dry, unless you bounce with the effects afterwards. This is the point that confuses me.

    Going back to your screen shot at the beginning of this thread, if you were to turn off or bypass the all the channel insert and sends effects, you would hear dry audio. Yes?

    The only way to "burn in" the sound in Logic is to bounce with the effects, or create Input channels in the Environment, then add effects to them.

    Will return tomorrow if you have additional questions.
     
  8. mertas

    mertas New Member

    I made recording in summing track see screenshot below.
    1. i activated record button only "Clean" track - created blue audio file + semi green file in summing stack track
    2. i activated record button on all tracks inside of summing track - created blue audio file + semi green files in other tracks

    in both cases I do not hear changes when changing effects on tracks inside of summing track. so now for me unworkable status.
    do you understand my trouble? what do I do wrong way?
     

    Attached Files:

  9. mertas

    mertas New Member

    I partially solved:
    I changed 3 tracks from audio to aux and situation is better now - see screen.
    anyway - in summing track, there is parallel recording - clean track + aux track plugins.

    if I change aux plugging setting they do not influence once recorded regions? that makes it still useless for further mixing processing. ...
    is it correct behavior?
     

    Attached Files:

  10. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    You have a red audio region on the Jazz clean Methany2 track which is the main track of the Summing stack. You're not using the sends of that track, so you will not hear the plug-ins.

    Template
    https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2A-BaiDcF5TNWVXdlg3T2RJajg
    See if this make sense. Record on the audio tracks within the summing stack, and you will certainly hear changes made to the effects.
     
  11. mertas

    mertas New Member

  12. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    Your routing is fine, no different that my template.

    After looking at looking at your screen shots again, and considering your concern that you're not hearing effects changes, it looks like the audio you have on the red Jazz clean Methany2 track, which is the main track of the Summing stack, does not have any active sends. See attachment.

    If you route those sends to the effect aux channels, you will hear the effects.
     

    Attached Files:

  13. mertas

    mertas New Member

    no no, this is not the aim. you template works, my not and they are identical. is yours really summing track not stack track?
     
  14. CSeye

    CSeye Senior member

    You're right. For some reason, the audio in your template isn't reaching the stereo output. Visually, it looked fine.
    I imported it into all tracks into an empty file and it still didn't work.

    If my template is working, leave all the tracks in place, but remove the plug-ins, and apple loop. Delete Undo History in the Edit menu, then save the summing stack tracks as a Patch. Save my file as a template. You can now continue to create your complex
    guitar patches.

    Yes, my patch is a Track Stack>Summing Stack.

    Cheers.
     

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