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Logic 9 timpani crescendo

Discussion in 'Logic 9' started by Edgold, Aug 21, 2011.

  1. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    I'm using the EXS24 regular timpani and, though I only just now had some success in producing a drum roll cresc. I can't seem to refine how I draw the note velocity mode line which goes every which way using the pencil tool.

    If I try to use the crescendo window and I select the notes and set it to 1-127 for example, it sets all the notes of the roll to 127 with no change. I don't get what I'm doing wrong.

    I also tried using the timpani crescendo sample but that doesn't seem to work at all.
     
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  3. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    I guess you try to do that in the Piano Roll right ?
    The drum rolls trick is to use the Hyper Edit. In hyper Edit select the "All velocities lane and use the pencil to draw a drum roll. You can draw note events and velocities in same time. You can use the "Line" tool after the pencil as well. Here the main setting factors in the Hyper Edit Inspector are the "Grid", "Pen Width" and the "Length". For example if you want to draw 16th roll notes you choose 1/16 in the Grid parameter box etc.

    The midi region must be selected in the Arrange when use the Transform Window. Have a look at the "Position" setting of the Crescendo template (by default it is set to "Inside" 1-5). Customize the position setting regarding the drum roll and hit "Select & Operate". If the "Inside" setting is not correct the Transform may give unexpected results !

    A.G
     
  4. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    Thanks Tangra,

    It will take me some time to work through all of this but I will get back to this thread when I do.

    Ed
     
  5. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    I guess that my remaining main question about this topic has to do with the line tool. My lack of understanding of the hyper edit was pretty much resolved when I realized that you had to enlarge it vertically before you could draw with the pencil tool.

    But the line tool, whether or not applied after the pencil tool, may or may not work and it isn't clear when it does and and when it doesn't. It's also obvious that I have never really understood the parameters in the inspector or convert window and I'm not sure this is dealt with in the manual.
     
  6. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    Hi Ed,

    Try this: Draw in a series of notes in the hyper editor where you want your roll to be. Set the note length resolution and just use the pencil tool and drag across from left to right. Don't worry about the velocities for now. A series of notes will be created. Next, select the line tool. Click at the bottom of the first note. Move your mouse to the top of the last note where your crescendo ends and click the mouse again. All velocities will be scaled smoothly from the first note to the last note at that point. The line tool is used to scale the velocities.
     
  7. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    Thanks Eli,

    Ok, I think I understand. But one further problem is the quantizing which, in the dummy file I'm using will not produce any notes faster than sixteenths for the roll. So 1/16 is the last that will work and produces a line of 16th notes for the roll. At the file tempo, it doesn't seem fast enough and I'd probably prefer 32nds.
     
  8. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    You can set the resolution of the notes created with the pencil tool from the Inspector. Make sure you have the hyper editor section highlighted, and the right lane selected.
     
  9. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

     
  10. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    Hi Ed,

    Check out this screen shot. You need to make sure that the length is shortened from the default of 1 0 which is a sixteenth note.

    Here I set the resolution to 32nd notes. I chose a smaller pen width so I could see what's going on more clearly. And I set the length of each note to 79 clock ticks (I just chose that amount randomly; the important thing is that it's less than the note length of each 32nd note). And it worked out fine. I drew in the notes in one stroke with the pencil tool. And then two clicks of the line tool and the whole thing was scaled.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    Hi Eli,

    Ok, by Jove, I think I've got it. There's one minor problem but let's see if I have it right: I have to go into the piano roll to change the note length. The only thing that seems wrong is that the note lengths seem to alternate in length from long to short when you enlarge the piano roll horizontally. This doesn't seem to make much difference in the sound , if at all.

    One further question has to do with slightly randomizing the velocities so it doesn't sound like a machine gun. I assume I'd use "humanize" in the transform window?
     
  12. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    You can do it all in the hyper editor. Shorten the note length value in the inspector before you draw in the notes. That way the newly created notes will take on the new note lengths.

    Scale the velocities with the line tool. And yes, you can randomize the velocities +/- whatever range of values you want in the transform window.
     
  13. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    Thanks again Eli,

    Between saying goodnight to Irene and trying to get through the morning, I've been able to do everything. Now back to my big Merlyn project.

    Ed
     
  14. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    Hi Edgold,

    I'm sorry for the latency. In my first reply I pointed on the most essential things about the Hyper Edit - here is my quote below:
    You did not pay an attention in that that's why you had to post much more times about each point. Anyway big thanks to Eli for the step by step support about these essential factors I was talking about.

    Here is some additional information how to fine humanize your work.

    1. After using the Line tool in Hyper Edit you have noted that the result is quite artificial velocity line that's why you were asking for the "humanize" Transform template - right? The "Humanize" transform template will do some job but in a later step (see below). What I mean is that the "Humanize" Transform template will randomize the positions, velocity and length but the velocity will be randomized "linearly" !
    To prevent that you must do one more step in the Transform before using the "Humanize" template.
    Choose the "Crescendo" template and change the Velocity operation from Cres. to Expon - Fig.1 below. Hit select and operate.

    2. Choose the regular "Humanize" template in the transform and change the velocity and length settings as shown in Fig.2.

    3. Another "Humanization" last step scenario is to get or make some Drum Roll groove template and apply to your roll as custom "groove quantize" etc. In this scenario you can disable the Position randomization of the "Humanize" Transform preset in the previous step !

    A.G

    [​IMG]
    Fig.1​

    [​IMG]
    Fig.2​
     
  15. Edgold

    Edgold Senior member

    Yes, Thanks Tangra,

    I'm still a bit bewildered by all of this but will experiment with what you have written though I'm still recovering from our so-called "hurricane Irene". If I have further questions, I will ask them.

    Once again, thanks both.
     
  16. Eli

    Eli Senior member

    Hey Tangra,

    Very nice description and example of how to use the exponential operation in the transformer!
     

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